The Rover-Landers of BC

And so it begins: Meet 26400157a, listed as 1963 but I suspect it is earlier (to be confirmed). This is the one from the Saskatchewan British Car Club web page. Drove all the way from Langley to Saskatoon with my father-in-law to get it, dragging a 20' rented trailer. It was an adventure...

Left around 0730 on Monday morning, making a straight 16-hour shot to Saskatoon. Pete's truck broke down in the middle of the night in Kindersley, SK, about 2 hrs from Saskatoon. Spent an unplanned night there.

Tuesday morning arranged for truck repairs, and the previous owner was very kind and came out to pick us (and the trailer) up. Got into Saskatoon late afternoon. Took a look at the Rover and a parts donor vehicle, then spent the evening drinking beer, discussing the purchase and speculating on whether the dude at the dealer in Kindersley would actually have Pete's truck fixed on Wednesday morning as they claimed (turned out it was a bad injector, so not super-difficult to do). [Note the foreshadowing here].

Wednesday morning, the plan was to drive out to the parts donor vehicle site (on a farm outside Saskatoon) and get busy disassembling. That went pretty well, honestly, only a little bit of Sawzall action but plenty of strong language. The wind... if you haven't experienced the prairie wind, complete with blowing sand and dehydrating humidity, it is difficult to explain the relentless pressure, the grit that gets everywhere, the way your sinuses turn into beef jerky and your eyes scrape with each blink. The previous owner took Pete to the bus station to go back to Kindersley and collect his truck, it being, incredibly, fixed when they said it would be. Really hard to believe that, it was. Still is.

So there I am, continuing on my own in the relentless wind and sand, unbolting and saving everything I can from the '67 109 pickup. It was quite meditative, actually, especially when I considered what would happen if I actually hurt myself. I had a first aid kit and the emergency kit from the tailer, but those are only useful if you can get to them. Anyway, I didn't hurt myself, and I was all packed up and waiting for the previous owner to return when I got the call from Pete.

His truck was repaired, except for the part where it pissed diesel all over the place when he started it up. The mechanic immediately diagnosed another failed injector (the things are about $800 a pop, by the way). And they didn't have another in stock, so it would be Friday before they could even start. Now, you guys don't know Pete, but if you ever meet him, you will understand that he has little patience for people who don't really try, especially when they say they are. So right there in front of the guy who is saying it can't be done, Pete finds another injector in Saskatoon, calls me to tell me where it is and to go get it and put it on the evening bus to Kindersley. Which I did, again with the kind assistance of the previous owner. The previous owner and I load up the trailer and haul it bask to Saskatoon, and I spend another night, this time with a cousin in town who I thought was still living in Alberta but I was wrong. Nice to see you, Jim!

So now it's Thursday morning - bear in mind that the trailer is due back in Langley on Friday morning - and Pete marches into the dealer in Kindersley as they open, plunks the "unavailable" injector down on the counter and suggests in his compelling manner that they get to fixing, which, unsurprisingly, they do.

Meanwhile back at the ranch, the P.O. and I complete the money and paperwork part, having agreed on a price, and set to figuring out how to load all the stuff into the trailer. I'm ok with this kind of thing, but Pete is much better qualified as a loadmaster and I am really hoping he shows up sooner rather than later. He finally pulls in around lunch time, and stuff starts getting done, including figuring out how to bring back that damned tub, which is one feck of a lot bigger than it appears. One last inspection, check all straps, bolt the doors, shake hands with the P.O. (whose kindness really can't be understated), and we hit the road for home. We stop for fuel just outside town, which is when Pete notices that the truck is pissing diesel all over the place again.

Now Pete is a man of few words. And having known him for a while, and particularly after spending many quality hours of solitude with him on this epic adventure, we don't say much. We simply head west, because there is no way we are going back. We are headed for the next big city with a proper GMC truck dealer who can put this sh*t right for good and all, and that place as it turns out is North Battleford, SK.

So there I am on the phone with the diesel tech at Bridges GMC in North Battleford, and as soon as he comes to understand what is happening he emphatically orders us to shut down the motor, right now, immediately. Which we do, pulling off the highway at a place called Ruddell, SK. There isn't anything in Ruddell, except for Vic. Vic is a young guy who has a little house he is renovating, a couple old tractors that are really cool, a supply of cold beer and a place to park the trailer for the night while the truck gets towed on to "North". We stay at the casino/hotel there, blow our $10 voucher in about 4 minutes on the slots, have a decent meal and a couple drinks, and listen to the wind outside. Actually, that's an embellishment, because I have earplugs crammed into my skull due to the fact that Pete snores like a trip-hammer.

So now it is Friday morning, and we take a taxi over to the dealer. The senior tech there has taken pity on us, bumped us to the head of the line, and determined a few things:
1. There was nothing wrong with the second injector.
2. The diesel leak was because the tech at the dealer in Kindersley neglected to tighten the fuel line fitting.
3. The tech in Kindersley also left the air cleaner box open, causing an airflow sensor to mis-read, setting off an engine light and generally making the computer freak out on the fuel mix.
4. The tech in Kindersley also left a very nice 3/8' drive ratchet and a 13mm impact socket on top of the motor. Now mine. All of the above were quickly and properly rectified, a new fuel filter fitted and an oil change done, and we are rolling again, back to Ruddell to grab the trailer and make a beeline west for home. Need a diesel mech in North Battleford? Bridges GMC. Need one in Kindersley? Tow truck to anywhere else.

Friday still, and as the sun sets we see the Rockies. We drive through Jasper and Mt.Robson parks (back in BC!) and everything is roaring along. I have contacted the trailer place, and they have kindly extended to Saturday morning without charge. We decide to stop in Kamloops for a few hours' sleep. Better safe after all this...

Saturday morning, we fire up the big diesel (chipped, with a big exhaust, it makes a racket but pulls the load like it isn't there), grab yet another revolting McDonald's breakfast and make what feels like a trivial run for home. We get in at about 8:30, get to unloading and Pete hauls the trailer off to return it before my kid has even poked her head out the door to see the Rover, which she pronounces to be "cool".

And that, right there, may have been the highlight of the whole trip.

The adventure has begun! Well done persevering through all your bumps along the way so far - looks like you have a great starting point for your project.

Great story Mike!

What's the plan for the old girl?

Any more pics of the project - she looks like a beauty.

Cheers

Dave

Planning for a pretty major restoration, but not to a maniacal extent. I love the original metal-dash look, the banjo wheel, the utilitarian aspect of the IIa. I am struggling with whether I will replace all the interior trim stuff or leave it bare metal; it is largely complete, but in stinky shape. That's a long way off of course, and events along the way may change my mind more than once. I will go so far as to remove and re-galvanize all the steel bits, and strip/blast/prime/epoxy aircraft paint all the body parts. I have not settled on a colour, but am leaning toward "British Standard Aircraft Grey", which is not original but is a great colour for a Rover.

I will, however, be doing sensible upgrades such as going to negative-earth alternator, maybe parabolics, better headlights, modern Dynamat sound insulation and boosting the performance of the motor. Not planning on changing the motor, trans or diffs, but might splurge on a Roamerdrive one day. I don't want to make it into a modern vehicle, just a very drivable old one. I get tremendous satisfaction from cleaning, repairing and restoring old stuff, it's a mental break from my day-to-day work.

I know a couple aircraft mechanical engineers who really know how to rivet, so I will buy beer to get that stuff done. I need a good, local and sympathetic welder. And I need to get much of the crap out of my garage so I can get going on filling it up with this new crap.

I can't wait to get started. Pics soon.

Mike

Great truck, congrats!
What a trip! Reading it reminds me of my former life on the ole prairie, makes me very glad to be living in BC!
There's a lot of crud to be removed and parts cleaned so here's hoping you find some Zen!

Terry

Been a while, but I have worked on the 109 on and off. Removed all the interior, the roof and sides, both wings. Tub is now completely unfastened (I think) and ready to come off, and the B-Pillar/sill pieces are off (I am sure there is a better method than I fought through to do these, but they are off with no damage). I pressure washed everything I could hit at this point just to get it cleaner and get a better look.

No nasty surprises, really... the B-pillar has rust in the usual place at the 45deg bend behind the rear doors. Looks repairable to me. Frame looks pretty damn good - rear x-member needs fix/replace, the stupid cow bar on the front has to be cut off and there may be issues with the original bumper mounts related to that. There are patches at the forward spring shackle mounts that I might want to have re-done to be sure they are done properly, but I really don't think I need a new frame.

In a triumph of cash over scarcity, I have found and purchased a complete NOS set of 638 and 639 flat glass sidelights and indicator beehives, the correct type with the notches. $85 USD each. Holy crap... but they are damn rare so I figured I better strike while I can.

I had a good conversation with Aart at UK Trek and Traction. He seems knowledgeable, likes Land Rovers and talking about them and has strong opinions on parts suppliers... he deals with OEM Land Rover stuff primarily, which he freely admitted was going to be "expensive". Just wondering what peoples' experience with them has been?

Whereabouts in Langley are you?

I'm at a similar place in my teardown, would be nice to keep in touch and share information. I'll have to work to keep my thread updated! :)

Score! The elusive flat-front, notched-with-2-screws North American type sidelights and beehive indicators. Not very cheap, but perfect.

From http://www.jollyrogersmotors.com. Nice people.

The bulkhead is off! Breakfast, rad and grille are undone, but I need to remove the fan cowl to get it out. Couldn't face that at quarter to 11 last night.

Hello all, it's been a while. Renovated/sold/bought/renovated a couple houses (well, not quite finished the new one).

And now at long last the return of the Big Red One-oh-Nine is within sight. Madly working on getting my tiny little garage organized to the point where I can get a large Land Rover into it and still work on it. My brother is coming out from Ottawa in a couple weeks to give me a hand on it, so I now have a strict deadline to work toward!

I bought a new frame from Jeremy, and will shortly be asking him for an initial supply of parts. My god that frame is so pleasing... all clean and shiny and straight with nice new bushings already in it...

So, watch this space for new developments... finally!

New frame in the shop!
Motor disassembled. Took it to a frind of my father-in-law, who it turns out it one of the best engine machinists in North America (Johnny Cleveland). He usually builds huge race motors, but he says he can work on this little baby engine - zero-balance the crank and flywheel, shave, port and polish the head, replace valve guides, skim the block and all the other machinist stuff. Might end up being the smoothest-running lump of tractor motor ever...
I've been waiting a long time for this one... brand new Roamerdrive, picked up from the factory in West Van. So stoked for this, even though it's probably a year before I get to use it!
More work, and more pics to come.

There's nothing quite like building onto a new chassis. Don't let your engine expert friend machine the valve guide clearances without consulting the shop manual and sticking to the spec. values or you'll likley have sticky valves in short order.

That, sir, is a nice chassis.

Ok now this is a score: Found a pair of SU carbs, HS6 model, in excellent condition. I’m going to rebuild both and probably sell the spare. I’m so stoked - nice to run into some good luck! //uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201712 ... 280b9d.jpg

Crank and block back from machinist. Work continues on port/polish for the head.
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Getting the head and block masked off for paint. This takes way longer than expected, just like everything else...
This is the head in high-heat primer. Might get to spray the block today.
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Sprayed the head. I used “Detroit Diesel Alpine Green”, which I don’t like as much as the Light Admiralty Grey that it’s supposed to be, but a couple spray cans vs. the time and expense of getting a custom colour mixed... //uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201802 ... 5eb3f3.jpg

NICE! That's a thing of beauty! Hopefully it will purr like a kitten when running!

Not a very good picture, but you can see some of the grinding for the gas flow work on the head. It’s really a dramatic difference from before; all the sharp corners and rough casting marks have been smoothed, and the passage has been enlarged and straightened quite a bit. Johnny also skimmed the head - it was significantly not flat.
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Crank is in! Bearing clearances were perfect, end float was nice and snug.
The rear main bearing cap and the cursed T-seals were a moderate pain in the rear. An assistant would have helped. I used feeler gauges and Ultra Grey to help things slide and to seal more effectively. Maybe it won’t leak! (yeah right)

The rear main seal was another pain. I have to say, that is a stupid design. It is going to leak. Maybe if I’m lucky it won’t pour out like I left the drain plug out. Followed procedures, plenty of Ultra Grey again, some choice words when locating the seal carrier halves, but it’s done.
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Looks nice!

Cam is in, rear cover, cam sprocket too. Tappet guides, rollers and tappets are in. Guide securing bolts in and lockwired- that was kind of fun but not easy, the bolt holes don’t line up in a convenient way to do a pretty job, and the head bolt bosses make it hard too. Still, they aren’t coming undone and it looks ok.

Anyone have advice for the distributor drive gear install? I’m not clear on the alignment or easiest procedure.

Gravy, I might need to take you up on the offer of borrowing or scanning the Haynes - the Green Bible is pretty weak in this area!
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I will scan a couple of pages for you this week!

oldgravy wrote:I will scan a couple of pages for you this week!

You're a star! Thanks!

Well, I figured it out. It only took about 6 tries to get the cam and drive gear in the correct relative positions, and then only 3 more to get both that and the hole for the grub screw lined up. I now pretty good at doing something I will not do again for years, by which time I will have forgotten how.

Big day for parts. New wiring harness plus optional extras from Autosparks, tracked down an extractor header and ACR SU manifold from Ike, and my piston rings are finally in hand. Busy weekend ahead.
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Blasted and painted both manifolds...
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Looking great, just like new! That's some fancy looking pipework.

Well done!

Did that thing that you do with the front crank seal cover.
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I will be getting to that stage soon. Looks good with the hex head bolts, did you re-tap the threads or?

Yes. Drilled, then tapped. Size of the screws escapes me but I can figure it out later if you’d like...

Buffed the rocker cover a little. I’m not totally happy with it but if I don’t find any more time or patience to get it shinier it will at least be clean and bright.
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Various bits getting the POR-15 treatment.
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Looking fantastic!

Are you using a rattle can, paint gun, brush, or The Force?

oldgravy wrote:Looking fantastic!

Are you using a rattle can, paint gun, brush, or The Force?

Well, all of the above as it happens.
Brush for the POR-15 rust thing, then spray bomb for the top coat. And always The Force.
Although I must admit something goofed (me). I think it hit it with the top coat too soon, many pieces were all blistery and I may have to do them again.

I want to share some of my humbling experiences over the past while.

I did a dumb thing... well, two actually. First was to go completely stunned and use the wrong torque value on my con rod nuts. I have (had) the older, drilled-tip , rolled-thread type. Torque spec for those is 25 ft-lbs. I sadly saw the torque value for the later machined-thread type, torque value 35 ft-lbs. I stretched them all, some of them visibly, and have been waiting for replacements for weeks now. The only consolation is that it was caught before the motor blew itself up months from now.
The second thing, less horrifying, was that I neglected to remove the engine mount bracket from the right side of the chassis before we chopped it up and recycled it. And it didn’t even figure that out until I happened to see an S2 club Facebook post go by that mentioned it, and I went “Uh oh.”
Matt, whom I met at Founders’ Day, suggested that I go and pick through the many crates of stuff that the two bearded gentlemen whose names I have forgotten had brought. And there it was: Rusty and neglected, but shining bright as the $5 answer to my despairing frustration with myself.
Humility is important. Luck is, too. And so are good people who are willing to help when haste, fatigue, ignorance or stupidity have showed up to teach me a lesson again.
I really enjoyed Founders’ Day, especially meeting some of you characters in person. And especially knowing that there’s a bunch of decent people around this club who can help, and whom I can maybe help in return one day. Thanks guys.

Bought one of those attachments that turns a pressure washer into a wet sandblasted. It works, it makes a hell of a mess, and it’s pretty unpleasant because you blast yourself with little bits of crushed glass. Safety glasses mandatory.
They steel flash rusted as I watched - kind of interesting actually. Not too concerned about that as it will go through the POR-15 process.
Interesting also was the revealed replacement rear diff: 1966 (truck was built ‘62). May have something to do with the dents in the casing that were made from the inside, presumably as the diff exploded...
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Looking Great Mike. This is going to be one nice rover! It was great meeting you, and some other new faces, at founders day this year. I look forward to having a drag race when your motors back together ;) Maybe a new event for Founders Day?
PS I have an extra Haynes manual I can mail out to you. Just PM me your address.

Matt

Hey Matt! Yeah a drag race might be fun... not perhaps the fastest time ever...

Thanks very much for the Haynes offer, but I have finally obtained my very own (Hardcover, too, quite fancy...)

Now, if you find yourself on the mainland any time soon, a consult on the gearbox is always welcome...

Cheers!

Finally received new bolts from England. Took the rods, bolts and nuts over to Johnny to have him ream the big ends to circular again (the new bolts slightly alter the cap position so the bearings won’t seat properly). Installed them again tonight. All went well this time, thankfully - didn’t stretch any rod bolts this time.
Next will be attempting to degree the cam to be sure the cam sprocket is in the best position and that the 2.5 cam is doing what I think it should. Does anyone have experience doing that on these motors?
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Degreed the cam today - I think. It was nowhere near as clear as the YouTube videos made it, but I think at the end of it all it is advanced by 3 or 4 degrees which is supposed to be good for when the chain stretches as it runs in.
Timing cover went on so that’s it until I start it up sometime in the future. Hope to hell I haven’t screwed up...
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Just make sure you have appropriately read the entrails of a goat slain under a full moon before you turn the key.

oldgravy wrote: Mon Apr 30, 2018 11:36 am Just make sure you have appropriately read the entrails of a goat slain under a full moon before you turn the key.

Ha! No kidding... I'm going to have at least one person around who is smarter than me at this when the time comes...

More bits bolted on.
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Great job .... looks like new 8)

ANDYD wrote: Thu May 03, 2018 11:31 am Great job .... looks like new 8)

Thanks Andy! In about 7 more years I'm hoping to win the People's Choice... :roll:

Milestone: Motor in the frame.
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Squeezing in about an hour a day, progress is slow. Shiny rear axle bits.
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Nice shiny paint but you made the same mistake as me by painting the mating surfaces on the flange. Mine are now leaking gear oil and Its on my list to take a wire wheel to them... sorry to e a buzzkillington!

Yes, well spotted, unfortunately. Meant to not paint the sealing surface and simply forgot to mask it. The paint removal has started already - although it’s POR15 and is now chemically bonded and is an absolute bugger to strip off. I’ll settle for having the various pits, scratches and dings in the metal filled in, in the hopes of it leaking less.

Rear axle nearly complete. //uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201806 ... 108793.jpg

5 brand-new 7.50x16 Super Traxions.
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The_Anachronist wrote: Thu Jun 14, 2018 10:09 pm Rear axle nearly complete.

I know I'm pretty new at this but isn't the axle supposed to go underneath the frame?

oldgravy wrote:

The_Anachronist wrote: Thu Jun 14, 2018 10:09 pm Rear axle nearly complete.

I know I'm pretty new at this but isn't the axle supposed to go underneath the frame?

Nah I’m just trying to get more ground clearance when inverted...

Tires mounted up, rims sandblasted and powder coated. The colour (RAL 9001) is whiter than limestone but that is intentional to go better with the eventual paint. Big knobby old-school tires looks good!
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Where did you get those tires? I need to replace mine and those look perfect

Thx

M

bsa_m21 wrote:Where did you get those tires? I need to replace mine and those look perfect

Thx

M

Simpletire.com

Free delivery. Had them sent to my US mailing address in Blaine. Reasonable pricing and excellent service.

NOS, 61 years old!

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