Springs for Defender

[DBrands]

The springs under my 90 look tired. It seems the shocks have been replaced at least once (still seem to dampen fairly effectively, as far as I can tell), but I don't think I can say the same for well-being of the springs :lol:

I am leaning towards stock springs, or a softer spring that'll maintain about the same ride height or within an inch. (ie, range rover police spec nrc4304 or something similar)

There seems to be a ton of information out there, but I can't really find a concrete answer on what my best bet is.

Most people go for a lift of 2+ inches, but I don't really see a huge benefit in that other than 2 more inches of clearance under the frame rails.

Does anyone have $0.02?

[Dave_F]

I went with the standard Genuine LR HD spring set up for my 110.

It's a little harder when unloaded, but loaded up it's perfect.

It does give my truck about 1.5" over standard ride height. I am on BFG KM2 225/85-16's

At the same time replaced the genuine shocks with Old Man Emu's...very pleased overall with the setup. Good articulation as well.

The only complaint is due to the front springs being "handed" it tends to sit a little uneven when I am not in the drivers seat.

Cheers,

[ANDYD]

Your new spring selection should be based on the primary use of your Land rover (on road / off road / load carrying / trailer use.. etc) and how many heavy "toys" you already have or want to put on it. (ARB bumper / winch / spare tyre on the hood etc).

I have been happy with Old man Emu Springs in the past. Generally I have found that if you go for what they call a 2" lift it normally always ends up being a 1" lift by the time its all said and done! Also I would still change your shocks out at the same time as you do the new springs. (even if they dont look too bad)

Cheers, Andy

[red90]

Have your springs sagged? Measure the normal length of them with the truck on a flat, level surface and report back. If they have not sagged then there is no reason to replace them. Springs do not wear out.

Based on your description, I would replace with stock. If you want lighter, there are a few possibilities, but you need to be careful with how much you plan to carry.

If you are not happy with the ride comfort, I would suggest better shocks. The Koni heavy tracks are amazing and not that expensive.

[DBrands]

Thanks for the replies Dave, Andy, and John.

I am leaning towards stock springs, as I intend to run 235/85/16 tires and won't be doing any intense offroading.

Won't the springs sag with age? The 90 is a 1990, and the springs are well-pitted. I just assumed, but now that you make the comment that I should check the height, I think I will do that. I suppose I could check the height and reference one of those land rover spring charts that are floating around the internet? I have the rears off right now.

Where do you source your KONI shocks from? Is $150 a shock the going rate for a koni heavy track?

What's the going rate for low-, mid-, and high-end shocks?

I take it OME are mid-range, and Koni are high-end?

[red90]

IME, genuine springs do not usually sag. Properly built springs should last forever. Measure the height as I said and get back to me. I can tell you if they are normal or not.

The heavy tracks are $150 a pop. Cheap shocks are around $50. Mid range stuff $100.

Contact John Hilton at Overseas Auto, http://overseas-auto.com/ for the Konis. He is a Rover guy and great to work with.

[Bill E.]

Hi David,
Just for interests sake, here's a photo of a stock front military 90 spring with about 200,000 km's on it next to a brand new stock Land-rover HD front spring. You can see the extra wraps in the new spring and a slight height difference. I went this route because the added weight of my PTO winch and bumper was pounding the hell out of my front end while off roading.

http://roverlanders.bc.ca/gallery-photo ... g_swap.jpg

[Dave_F]

IME, genuine springs do not usually sag. Properly built springs should last forever.

My Genuine Land Rover front springs definitely did.

Nothing better than new springs and shock though...like new shoes :D :bounce: :D

Shoot me your email as I have a good PDF on Springs.

[red90]

Hi David,
Just for interests sake, here's a photo of a stock front military 90 spring with about 200,000 km's on it next to a brand new stock Land-rover HD front spring. You can see the extra wraps in the new spring and a slight height difference. I went this route because the added weight of my PTO winch and bumper was pounding the hell out of my front end while off roading.

Just so people understand. More wraps make a spring LESS stiff. Those ones are stiffer because the bar used is a larger diameter. The other difference in those two, is the new spring is two stage, so gets stiffer past a certain point.

And, fyi, those HD springs are the standard rear springs for some 90s, if people like to look for deals, they can usually be found freeish. http://www.red90.ca/rovers/NRC9462_3.html

http://www.red90.ca/rovers/springinfo.html

[DBrands]

Bill, what part number were those HD springs you upgraded to?

So, if I am going to be running a Warn 8274 and bumper, should I be upgrading to a heavier duty spring on the front?

Something like NRC 9462/3?

Could I put Disco rears, NRC 8044/5 on the rear of the 90?

The current rears seem quite stiff.

But I may just keep the rears as is, or try find some cheap/free disco rears to try, upgrade the front springs to handle the added weight up front, and see about upgrading all the dampers.

It is a 90 pickup and I don't see myself carrying any more weight than what would be required for a few days camping.

Anyone in support of this, or have a better idea?

What are you running John, if you wouldn't mind sharing.

[red90]

You can change to the 90 or Disco rear springs up front. The Discos rears are stock 110 front springs. The 90 rear will give a lift, the Disco ones should stay about the same.

My setup currently. 90 hardtop, 200TDI, lots of crap, 8274. Stock front springs with 10mm spring packers. NRC4303, 17", 170 lb/in rear springs with 1" spring spacers. This keeps things around level and fairly soft. Inside the rear springs are Airlift air bags with spacer blocks from a Firestone kit. I adjust pressure from the cab to keep the rear level as I add weight. And the Koni 8240SPX shocks.

[Bill E.]

Hi David,
My replacement fronts are NRC 9463, and like John says they are ninety rears. They are HD ninety rears. I believe John has posted a link to a chart with all the coils, including part numbers and colour markings. Perhaps he'll share that link again if you ask nicely.
Bill

[DBrands]

Well, I think I might give the Disco rears a chance first.
I should be able to find some on the cheap.
I have some spring isolators I could throw on if need be.

Now, if we digress into dampers...

Does anyone have thoughts on Bilstein dampers?
I suspect at $90-100 per, they'd be a mid-range set?

[red90]

Bilsteins run on the firm side. Some people like that especially on the road and they have a fairly big following. With you talk of wanting softer above, I'm not sure if this is what would suit you.

[DBrands]

I measured my rear coils this afternoon while they are off the truck.

Right hand side (Drivers): ~15 3/8" tall, ~9.25 coils (end to end, including ground ends)

Left hand side: ~14 7/8" tall, ~9.25 coils

Seems like they are the Rear HD 90 coils (NRC 9462/3)

No wonder my 90 pickup feels rough...

[Dave_F]

...any hint of colors swabs on the springs...that will tell you for sure what they are...if they are original Land Rover Springs.

Like Bill and mine in the pictures.

[DBrands]

Definitely no signs of colour swabs... too much corrosion!

[red90]

I measured my rear coils this afternoon while they are off the truck.

Right hand side (Drivers): ~15 3/8" tall, ~9.25 coils (end to end, including ground ends)
Left hand side: ~14 7/8" tall, ~9.25 coils

Seems like they are the Rear HD 90 coils (NRC 9462/3)

No wonder my 90 pickup feels rough...

OK, so no sag there, those are perfect factory numbers. Actually the 9462/3 are not any stiffer than the regular 90 springs. They are just dual rate, so take a load better. If it feels rough, it could be the shocks or perhaps you are not used to driving a short wheelbase truck? If you want a rough ride, go take a new Jeep Wrangler out for a spin....

[DBrands]

Yeah, it may be that I am not used to the short wheelbase. I think you've talked me into just driving it for a bit and see how it really is. I've put some newer, larger tires on to replace the hard, old, small originals. That'll probably make a pretty significant difference on its own.